Combining RK008 with other sequencers

adacey

I'm wondering what the best way is to integrate the RK008 and RK006 with other sequences if you want to play live and make use of the routing feature on the RK008?

I really like the simplicity of the routing feature for allowing me to keep my MIDI keyboard on one channel but still send the notes to whichever channel I want. However, the problem is that if I'm doing this while jamming and have any sequences running from something else then the RK008 sees the notes for all of those channels and routes all of that to whatever destination channel I'm routing to.

I'd tried figuring out the MIDI filters on the RK006 but found it a bit confusing for how to set this up on the USB port.

Right now I'm using a Circuit Tracks along with a MIDI keyboard and I'd like t one able to use the Circuit's 2 MIDI tracks for some sequencing. I know I could potentially just turn off MIDI not Tx on the Circuit and only use it for sequencing its own internal synths and drums but it feels like there should be a better option. I'd also like to potentially add something like a Torso T-1 or Oxi One to my setup for their generative capabilities and then I'd definitely want to be able to still use the routing features on the RK008 while they're running sequences as well.

What I was hoping I could do was connect the MIDI out from my keyboard directly to the MIDI in on the RK008 and then connect the RK008 to the RK006 via the USB connection so that I can power both off the same USB charging port. Then I'd hook any other sequencers into the MIDI in ports on the RK006. I think to make that work I'd need to setup the right filter on the RK006 so that it doesn't send notes to the RK008 via USB.

Alternatively, I know I could use 2 TRS cables for the MIDI connections between the RK008 and RK006. The filtering options on the MIDI out ports are a lot easier to understand so I think that filtering out the note data might be easier. But, that feels like I'm needlessly tying up ports on both devices and then I'd still need a 2nd USB port to power the RK008 so it just feels messy.

Has anybody else come up with a good solution for this kind of workflow?

grit

if you want to use more than one source for your midi sequences connecting them on the RK006 would probably be easiest yes, you could probably host the oxi/torso via RK006 USB so you have in and out available in one usb cable (and power it at the same time). It would also be possible to slave via regular midi, there is one extra midi in on the rk006 to use for that.

The key here would indeed be filtering so you won't have troubles with midi loops. If connected via USB for example you could have the RK006 send only clock to these devices, a filter would look like this:
FILTER:
RK006 as usb host
device: torso t1
direction: out from RK006
port match: both (1 regurarily works but I'm not sure how many interfaces there are on these devices via usb)
and then select the midi channels you want to mute so the oxi does not respond to it.

if you connect a device for sync via TRSmidi, the filter type needs to be set to 'TRS Port'.
In this case one filter then can handle more than one TRS port, just select the TRS ports you want to filter out the midi data and connect the devices to those ports who need to receive clock only.

adacey

Thanks for the quick reply. This isn't quite the situation that I'm hoping to solve, but it's giving me some useful pointers of future problems I might run into further down the line as I work out this setup.

I don't remember seeing the RK008 in the device list before, but now I do see it in the settings page. Based on what you've shared, this sounds like this should now let me set the RK006 to not send note data to the RK008, either entirely or for specific channels that I don't want the RK008 to see. That should then allow me to have another sequencer running and then still use the routing option on the RK008 for playing in other parts.

grit

ah o yes you also wanted to reroute sequencer output realtime via the RK008. If the RK008 / RK006 are paired up via USB then everything coming into the RK006 (USB and TRS) will first be processed through the RK008 and only after that be routed back to the RK006 outputs(there's a little plus sign on the RK008 display route menu when that is activated). So this could work but could also be something which turning out in something a bit more tricky because filtering out the RK008 when it is taking over RK006 routing might turn into something dirty - worth a shot though. Long-press the RK006 button and select preset 1 to reset it to default presets ;-)

adacey

Hmm, I'm not quite sure I get what the issue would be.

Maybe a simple scenario would help illustrate what I'm trying to do. Let's say I have 3 instruments, configured on channels 1, 2, and 3. Suppose that my other sequencer is transmitting notes on channel 1. Now I want to use my controller keyboard to play something on channel 2. But, if I use the rerouting option then the RK008 will route whatever the other sequencer is already playing on channel 1 as well as whatever I start playing on my controller keyboard. The same would happen if I then switch to another track on the RK008 and set it to reroute to channel 3.

What I was hoping would work would be if I connect the other sequencer to one of the RK006's MIDI IN ports and then setup a filter on the RK006 as a USB host to not send note data to the RK008 (at least on channel 1, or all channels if it's a more complex setup).

Effectively what I'd be looking for would potentially be a way to use the RK006's MIDI IN ports for any note data I don't want the RK008 to see, whereas USB and the RK008's own MIDI IN ports would be used for anything I do want it to see. But it sounds like you're suggesting there's more pairing/integration going on.

Unfortunately, I'm right in the middle of moving all of my gear from 1 room to another so I don't have anything hooked up at the moment to easily test this. I should see if I can just get a minimal setup quickly hooked up to see what happens.

grit

If you don’t force a midi channel output on a rk008 track it will just pass any midi channel on a track to the same output channel (also for recording) then you can go into the filter menu, one to the right (alt+4,>) and select a filter for notes and/or CC’s, program change, aftertouch, etc with the digit buttons. This works in realtime and might a modifier you could work with

adacey

I realised I left out a crucial piece of the proposed workflow. I've been watching a lot of Analog Kitchen's videos and really like the way that he sets up the RK008 with several of the tracks set to single MIDI channels so that when he's live jamming he can just switch between different instruments just by selecting different tracks on the RK008.

If I'm live jamming and using another sequencer then I have to deal with the RK008 seeing the notes that the other sequencer is generating in some way in order to avoid any double triggering of notes. I think I'd have the following options:

Turn off route on the RK008 - the RK008 will still see the notes from the other sequencer and I'd have to delete them before playing back anything I record. I'd also have to change the MIDI channel on my controller keyboard depending on which instrument I want to play.

Connect the RK008's MIDI OUT to the RK006's MIDI IN - I'd have to power the RK008 separately but this would absolutely ensure that the RK008 won't see any other notes transmitting through the RK006. I'd then connect my controller keyboard to the MIDI IN on the RK008. This would also require that the RK008 be the master clock.

Setup a filter on the RK006 so that it doesn't send notes to the RK008 - this seems like the best solution if it's workable. This would allow me to connect the RK008 to the RK006 via USB. I'd still probably connect my controller keyboard to the RK008's MIDI IN. As far as I can tell, this would have to be setup on the RK006 since filters on the RK008 apply to both inbound and outbound MIDI data, so filtering notes on the RK008 would mean I can't record any notes on that track or send any notes on that track.

I'd love to know if there's some other option. But it really does feel like setting up a filter on the RK006 is the best solution here since the filters on it offer so many more options than what's on the RK008.

grit

I guess the filters on the RK006 could work and you could use midi sysex messages to change the RK006 filters on the fly, but I think that will be a challenge to setup in midi in such a way that it will give you a certain kind of live-control on your setup. Also it seems like you have the rk008 and circuit both setup via USBmidi? If that is the case the RK006 will merge with the RK008 on it's own routing: all incoming data from the RK006 midi in and usb will first go through the RK008 before the RK006 sends it out again.

You could also indeed change the setup and set the RK008 to connect to the RK006 via TRS input1, (ensuring the RK008 will be master clock input for the RK008) and then add the sequencer to the other midi input of the RK006. You can use midi output 2 of the rk008 to slave your sequencer to tempo. (You can also setup tracks to be sent out to one midi output bus only, eliminating certain track notes coming into your sequencer from the other output bus)

If you need to be able to do midi channel switching from your sequencer (if it does not have that feature easily available ) you could put a RK002 on the sequencer output and make it change your midi channels on a certain note or CC value for example. We have done quite some tweaks with stuff like that on the RK002 and the novation circuit. You could maybe think up a method like holding a certain keypad for 'midi channel control mode' and while pressed, tap another keypad to switch output channel. This way you would have channel switching available on the RK008 but also separately on the other device.

adacey

No, my idea was to connect the Circuit (or another sequencer) to one of the RK006's MIDI IN ports and not USB. So my idea was if there's something transmitting MIDI data that I don't want the RK008 to see then I'd connect that to one of the RK006's MIDI IN ports and then just have a filter on the RK006 to not send that data to the RK008 over USB.