Using TRSAxB Dongle with Arturia stuff - What am I doing wrong?

Todd

Hi, I purchased the RK-006 bundle (from Perfect Circuit) and I've been happily using it with my gear over USB without issue. It's really been so simple, I'm amazed! Absolutely happy adding this piece to my setup 🙂

The problem I'm having is specifically with the RK TRSAxB dongle included in that bundle - I also purchased a few extras since I have a number of Arturia devices in my setup. So far I've been entirely unsuccessful in using any of these A/B dongles to direct connect any of my Arturia gear to any MIDI-A devices using either direct TRS, or 5-pin DIN to TRS. I've tried with Arturia Minilab, Beatstep, Keystep and Microfreak while also verifying the same connections work as expected with the Arturia supplied B/A dongle on each.

Below is a video using the TRSAxB dongle to demonstrate that MIDI works as expected over USB/RK-006, however does not work with a direct MIDI connections between devices using the Microfreak TRS Midi-out -> TRSAxB dongle -> TRS -> NTS-1 MK2 TRS Midi-in [both ends are set to use CH1] to try to replicate the simple MIDI path demonstrated in the product page for the RK dongle. Could someone tell me what I'm doing wrong here? Any help is much appreciated as this has been driving me nuts ever since I bought the bundle earlier this month - Thanks!

grit

Does the microfreak send out over trs midi by default? I'm not sure if the midi out on the microfreak is switchable to a / b , perhaps try without the trsaxb dongle as well and see if something comes in? the b/w striped cable is stereo right? Perhaps try with another stereo audio cable as well?

Todd

Thank you! That's the exact help I needed to improve my troubleshooting. Solved it for almost everything ...

Microfreak - Has a global setting for 'MIDI over:' USB, MIDI or BOTH setting, and mine was defaulted to 'USB' like you guessed.

I now have MIDI working entirely over TRS on the 'BOTH' (or 'MIDI') setting using the TRSAxB dongle and the striped TRS stereo cable you inquired about - yes!

Minilab and Keystep Pro - Looks like these two are actually MIDI-A by default so they both work direct MIDI-A DIN -> MIDI-A DIN TRS (from the bundle) -> TRS Midi-in

Turns out the dongle was actually screwing me up since I was assuming both were MIDI-B out because ... Arturia (lesson learned - I guess they use MIDI-A on newer hardware)

Beatstep (original, not 'Pro') - Still cannot get this one to send MIDI over TRS with the RK dongle

Works with the Arturia provided TRS to DIN A/B adapter -> MIDI-A DIN->TRS cable from the bundle
Still does not work with any combination or direction of the TRSAxB dongle with the known working striped TRS stereo cable

Frustrating, but less so than before because the main use cases are covered. I wish I knew what the problem is with the Beatstep, but it's not as painful as the others, and I'm actually going to replace it with a Pro next week anyways. I really appreciate the help thinking this one through grit!

grit

These are quite some findings, shows that a lot can happen with a few cables and boxes... I thought it didn't even have a midi out, perhaps you can just host it on the RK006 via usb on the OTG cable? You can also connect a regular USB2.0 hub on the RK006 and have it host multiple USB devices if you have it already in use.

Todd

Yes, USB hub w/ the RK-006 is exactly how I've been successfully using it so far, but was just looking at ways I could simplify for a smaller, more mobile setup just using the dongle to directly connect the Beatstep to a single synth or drum machine. Not a huge issue at all, just a minor frustrating problem that will require an extra adapter and cable vs the relative ease of the TRSAxB w/ a TRS cable. I love my RK-006 because it 'just works' and I don't need to think about any routing complexities or adapter/cable incompatibilities. Definitely one of the best purchases I've made. Really truly, thanks for your troubleshooting help @grit!

grit

I just saw another post here where was discovered by @Redfox hat the beatstep does not send power - and has a different connector, it’s a TS output. For what I understand a stereo trs cable with a mono ts plug on the other end would be very doable. You can solder this: Connect tip and sleeve on the mono plug to tip and ring on the stereo plug. If it does not work, swap tip and sleeve. This would be the most elegant solution.

Redfox

grit I actually disassembled my Arturia BeatStep to investigate this further, and the MIDI connector is indeed a 3.5mm stereo jack, with the ground seemingly connected properly. However, for some reason, the necessary voltage to power the RK-002 isn’t being provided.

I’ve already tried wiring both a TRS-A and TRS-B configuration, but neither worked. My next step is to power the setup using an external battery.

I’m only responding here because I was tagged, but any results or updates from my experiments will be posted in the original thread.

Dr. Kunz

The Arturia Beatstep MIDI out is a 3,5mm TS (mono if you like). The TS-DIN dongle in the box is different from the ones Arturia sells for the Beatstep Pro which are TRS-DIN. In general, MIDI connection is a current loop where MIDI Out port is the power source (typically 5V with 2 x 220 Ohm current limiting resistors, but more recently lower voltage has been adopted by low power devices) and MIDI In is the load (an optocoupler). Arturia decided to adopt TRS-B "standard" minijack for the Beatstep Pro, which IMO is better than the less common TS minijack we see in the former Beastep.

Hopefully this page may be useful in sorting out the MIDI connection affair https://minimidi.world/
Hope it helps

grit

Yes minimidi world indeed covers the connector variations very well, thanks for posting that link. Once TRS-A became official standard we stuck to it. The TS and even 2.5mm jacks are something of the past imho - but ok, we'll have to deal with those at times...

Dr. Kunz

grit So many standards to choose from... :-)
Personally I prefer DIN connectors as they are easy to solder and let me use shielded microphone cables, but have to admit minijacks aren't so bad for saving space in smaller instruments. I ended up getting a few packs of Befaco DIN to TRS-A and TRS-B cables from Thomann, just in case.

grit

We've got some solutions for this, TRSAxB Dongle, but also the TRS-X, in combination with a regular stereo audio cable or TRS-DIN5 cable you can cover these 3.5 TRS variations with different solutions. But we're focused on bringing it to TRS-A as much as possible, it's the standard now and does double wonders for the RK006

Dr. Kunz

The TRS-X is a clever solution I would have loved to build in my spare time :-)